WHAT Made Me CONTINUE In SEXUAL SIN

***Help Old School TODAY to continue our critical work promoting natural health, success, and freedom. Please DONATE NOW! Thank you!***

“Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!”

Isaiah 5:20 KJV

I have been in the midst of unloading a burden, and sending out a warning of wrongdoing, in these recent posts:

Sexual MOLESTATION–The Secret CRIME

When All Goes SILENT (After Disclosing SEXUAL CRIME)

After these disclosures, it’s apparent that the Christian minister who molested me and encouraged me to continue in this sin with him for a period of YEARS has shown no real remorse–just a bunch of excuses and admonitions to others who are involved in “vice” not to tell others about it.

Hmmmm… I wonder who that serves…

He’s telling men not to tell their wives (to get “sympathy”) if they have cheated on their spouse and committed ADULTERY!

Now, in fairness, I can see that a bad woman can use this information to destroy a man. But a good woman will forgive, so his blanket instruction is careless at best.

In this case, I disclosed my sexual sin to my wife and son. It was essentially a confession to my wife–that what we did was WRONG–damaging the sanctity of the “bonds” of my marriage! And it was a warning to my son not to get involved with this charismatic–yet evil–minister.

And after coming clean about my sin, my family is closer than ever–we are healing, thank God!

A sinner can be as secretive as he wishes, but that sin is SPIRITUAL, and one way or another it will work itself through the family. This happened in my family, as I explained in Sexual MOLESTATION–The Secret CRIME, and I know that this same thing has happened within the “family” of this minister (some of those who surround him).

It may explain why my disclosures have been met with general silence from this “family.” I’m not bitter toward them–in fact, I understand the subtle intimidation that causes them to remain silent. And perhaps their confusion–knowing about wrong but excusing it like he does, because “he does so much ‘good.'”

In the Sexual MOLESTATION… post, I linked to an article that explains How Cult Leaders Use Sex to Control Followers.

Related to this article is another one: 12 Characteristics of a Cult Leader. It’s fascinating that the minister who molested me, and who encouraged me to continue a sexual relationship with him over a period of yearsexhibits every one of these traits–some of them subtle, yet nevertheless they are there.

This minister scoffs at the notion that he is a cult leader, saying that he doesn’t even know how to brainwash people. HE likely does not know–but the Devil working through him knows exactly how to do it. These “characteristics” are commonalities–they represent a common spirit that works through all cult leaders.

Is the term “cult leader” too strong? Consider that–all claims to the contrary–a cult leader subtly makes HIMSELF the mediator between us and God, thereby replacing God’s son–our Savior, Jesus Christ.

A cult leader–while saying that people should go to God with their issues–keeps a busy counseling schedule and hosts a church service where people are encouraged to come to him to ask questions and seek advice.

Some of that advice is flat out wrong and dangerous as I’ve pointed out.

The vast majority of the advice this minister hands out would be unnecessary if counselees and congregants simply meditated and prayed with an earnest heart, and perhaps picked up a Bible once in a while.

I have told this minister that he is obsessed with being the “teacher”–the “corrector.” In fact, I learned the hard way that confronting him about his wrongs resulted in denials, and in him “flipping the script”–rejecting any serious correction while calling me “angry” for bringing up truth.

This goes on regularly with this minister. He seeks to discredit anyone who comes forward with any truth as being “angry” and therefore worthy of being dismissed.

He is an expert at playing the “anger” game. It goes like this: He pushes the buttons of those who challenge him. If he can succeed at getting them angry, he puts the focus on THAT, and not the substance of what they said. The outsider sees this exchange, and it appears that he is the “right” one, and they are wrong. It’s quite slick, and most may never notice it.

All manipulators know how to push the “right” emotional buttons to achieve their desired outcome, and to appear “good.”

This minister shows the outward appearance of calm. Is it real? I’ve come to see it more as something dead inside him. Dead people are indeed calm!

The (dead) giveaway is the eyes–do they show light or death? I urge those around him to look closely.

This minister has made a career out of taking the philosophy and even word phrases from another (now deceased) minister–without credit–and making them his own. I realized at some point that it was almost like a magic trick.

I’m not saying that the minister has no wisdom or insights of his own–I believe he does. God gives us all gifts. But I’ve noticed that where once I saw some innocence, I now see more and more corruption.

The learned knowledge is also getting more apparent–a virtual tape loop of the same points and phrases being repeated over and over. It’s noticeable to many.

Along the way I’ve noticed other negative traits–for instance, he lies habitually. I used to attribute it to him being “wise,” but it goes beyond that. He’s also unnecessarily cruel at times.

When you are conditioned to see someone a certain way, you are likely to excuse just about anything they do.

Redefining “Sin”

Despite what I’ve described (and I am not the only congregant / associate to accuse him of sexual sin), this minister claims he does not sin–he cleverly defines the primary sin as anger, and says that God will work our “vices” out of us once our heart is “clean.”

I agree that anger is a primary sin–but as I noted in the When All Goes SILENT… article, 1 Corinthians 6:18 plainly states…

“Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body.” (KJV)

Now I know that this minister has Bible passages read in his church that supposedly justify his sin (i.e.: Paul had a “thorn” in his side–possibly a sexual issue, but what matters is the heart, etc., etc.), but I challenge him to have 1 Corinthians 6:18 (or other scripture that speaks of the seriousness of sexual sin) read in his church. There are many passages in the Bible, actually, that speak to this.

I’ll wait patiently…

Our bodies are temples of God’s spirit. I’ve posted regarding being molested as a boy, and of my experiences with illicit sex afterwards. Defiling God’s temple seems pretty high up on the sin list!

Homosexual sex (or even sex outside of marriage) is not just some “vice” as this minister has said. It is evil and used as a doorway to deeper evil–to corrupting and even destroying the human spirit. Sex traffickers, Satanists… and cult leaders… know this, and use it for evil purposes.

Yes, this minister has told his congregation that God will work our “vices” out of us, once our hearts are clean. As I pointed out in When All Goes SILENT…, that may SOUND good, but in practice it means to him that it’s apparently okay to “work out your vices” with a married man–thereby attempting (the Devil in him) to drive a stake through the heart of that marriage and family.

Where’s the “love” in that?

There have been a number of broken marriages around this minister, and someone close to him has said, “If you want your marriage to last, don’t hang around [this minister].” This phenomenon is corroborated in 12 Characteristics of a Cult Leader.

“Born Again”?

So here is the kicker: the reason that I CONTINUED in sexual sin with this minister for a period of years is twofold:

#1: The minister convinced me that once I engaged in this act with him, I was “born again”! (I’ll explain below)

#2: I used this religious cover he provided as an excuse to indulge my perverse sexual appetite.

Am I really saying that this minister said that after having deviant sex with him I was “born again”?

Yes, he did say it.

Now, in fairness to him, I did FEEL a sense of freedom after performing sexual acts with him. I felt like I was walking on air, and the feeling stayed with me for a period of weeks.

I realize now that there is always the real, and next to it is the counterfeit.

What I felt was a sense of relief that the sexual identity / attraction that had grown in me after I was molested by a neighbor (another boy) was something I was no longer HIDING–SUPPRESSING.

I am sure that this is the same feeling that many homosexuals feel after their first “consensual” encounter (which often occurs sometime after they have been molested).

I now know that a sense of relief from suppression is not the same as being “born again.”

This was a LIE that kept me in sin. The minister knew how important it was for me to find spiritual freedom, and consciously or unconsciously played this card for all it was worth.

If this minister truly believes that having deviant sex with a member of his congregation is great therapy, then perhaps he should advertise this as a service he can provide in private counseling!

At some point I began to question the minister about our illicit sexual relationship. I’d say, “I can see that perhaps the first time (we had sex) had some value in getting me to be honest about what was inside of me (a post-molestation attraction to having sex with men), but what about all these other times?”

The minister had no answer for this, and I should have stopped then and there.

In fact, I finally did stop it. I told the minister I did not want to engage in this activity any more. Apparently, he thought I really didn’t mean it, and that I was playing some kind of game, so one day, while talking to him in his bedroom (big mistake!), he tried to force himself sexually on me, and I stuck my arm straight out–grabbing him by the throat and thus stopping his advance. I got out of there quickly.

While driving away on the main street, I got a call from him–he was furious, telling me to, “Never do that to me again!” He paused, thought better of continuing the tirade, and calmly ended the conversation.

From that point on, I knew that I had to leave, and I began to make plans to do so. Months later, I was out of there.

Continuing the “friendship”

After that time, I was angry with this minister, but continued our “friendship” from a distance. I would go back and forth in my mind–knowing all along what he had done, and alternately feeling angry about it and sometimes blaming myself only, and excusing his behavior.

I’d also rationalize what I knew and felt against the “good” that he was doing.

This went on for some time. After a while, I realized that whatever “good” he was doing was likely being eclipsed by things he was doing that were not good.

At some point, I confronted him–actually several times–to get all off my chest that I could.

And once I saw him making inroads with my son, I decided at that point to confront him directly about our illicit sexual relationship. I did not want to take the chance that this minister would spread his corruption any further in my family.

My son didn’t believe my accusation against the minister at first (he’d fallen for the hype that the minister was somehow “perfect”) and wanted to hear my accusation for himself, so I confronted the minister with my son present–and then with both my son and wife present.

Since then, little pieces have fit themselves together. What I mean is that, sometimes you will see something about someone that does not make sense–it is something that does not match what you think you know about them.

When you see one thing, you can easily dismiss it. But then you see something else. And then someone else comes forward with something similar. After a while, it’s like a quilt–and the true story emerges.

That’s what this situation has turned into.

I now believe that much of what I thought was real about this minister is actually a “scam.”

And that the “sins of the father” that I wrote about in Sexual MOLESTATION–The Secret CRIME–and which worked to try to destroy my family growing up, have been at work within me too.

I’d spoken of my father neglecting his duty to be the “head of his wife and family.” And of my mother having her own history of being abused by a clergy member she’d put her trust in, and by others.

I have lived the same life–not having a relationship with my father, and being angry with my mother for her over-protectiveness–which was brought on by the lack of guidance my father provided her.

I too trusted authority figures more than myself, having little inner confidence. And I–as well as my family–paid the price for that.

I have no knowledge that this minister is currently engaged in illicit sex with any congregant or associate. I simply do not know at this point.

I tell my story as a warning to this minister: You are being watched, so watch what you do.

And to those whom he may have harmed in one form or another–you are not alone. And you are not crazy. Those who wield power tend to misuse it, unless they are very grounded. Despite his claims to the contrary, and despite the illusions many of his followers apparently continue to hold, this minister is not morally grounded.

He is a sinner–like the rest of us. And from what I see–an unrepentant one. He has no business attempting to “teach” others how to live–he needs to get right with God, and actually show others how to live–without any more fakery or misdirection.

If this minister truly seeks to help others, he must reject his current course. I do not think he actually realizes what he is doing, as I’m now convinced that Satan has a hold of him, and Satan is the Great Deceiver.

As for me, as I’ve said, I take full responsibility for my part in all of this. I’ve come clean–with God and my family. Thankfully, they have forgiven my shortcomings.

Most importantly, I believe God has forgiven me too.

This is a true blessing!

I urge others to truly examine their hearts, and allow God to guide them toward right living. He will do it if they ask.

There’s nothing like living an honest life!

P.S. This–hopefully–is the last I need to post regarding this individual. I’ve said what I need to say, and am ready to move on. I hope this has been a useful warning to you.

Patrick Rooney is the Founder of OldSchoolUs.com. He communicates clearly and fearlessly during perilous times about natural health, success, and freedom. To reach Patrick, email him at [email protected].

To Support the critical work of Old School, go HERE.    

78 thoughts on “WHAT Made Me CONTINUE In SEXUAL SIN”

  1. One last thing. Why did you not mention his name is the article? Is it because you are afraid of a defamation lawsuit knowing the minister isn’t afraid to take people to court?
    Also God said go to the person and deal with the issue personally, not post it on a blog. In reality there is no point in posting this, other than to slander him and cause him to lose followers. You’re not spreading awareness about this minister, because you haven’t displayed any evidence. It wouldn’t be logical to just take you at your word.

    I also will say that what he says about being born again is real , at it happened to me. The removal of anger, anxiety, depression, the loss of ego, no desire for women or friends, feeling like nothing is missing, not caring about anything etc… happened to me and that exactly aligns with what he says. It seems really sus that someone with all that would have gay sex with a married man multiple times. Just sayin.

    I wish you well in whatever you’re going through. Take care.

    1. Fair questions, Spencer. I did deal with the matter personally, and the minister finally did apologize, though his subsequent actions did not demonstrate sincerity. (We did speak very recently, though, and we BOTH apologized about our roles with sincerity–see more below). As I said, I put out this issue publicly as a warning to those around him who could be in danger, and to him to let him know he is being watched. I am happy to hear about your born again experience. God bless you! And yes, what the minister says in this regard is true, just as most of the things he says are true. It’s the untrue things that can be most important. Just fair warning, I wanted you to be able to get your accusations out, but at this point I am censoring some responses (that agree or disagree with me), in the interest of bringing this matter back to me, and MY role in all of this. I plan to put out a post later this am, that I hope puts closure to this series and the true lessons learned. I hope you understand. I wish you well.

  2. I would like to add, that it seems strange that the comment section only consists of people that agree with you. My guess is you censored the opposition.

    My 2 cents is that I’ve heard you in church for years (im an online viewer). You never were serious about being born again, thus you never forgave (you still have anger) and I remember you always talking about God and this born again stuff with 0 wisdom(because you only learned it from the minister).Based on this , it definitely makes you capable of doing something like this.

    I don’t believe your claims at all, and would need evidence do so. But in reality this is just some attempt to slander that minister because you hate him for some reason or another. This reminds me of the rape allegations against trump, baseless and pure evil.

    So if “There’s nothing like living an honest life!” (like you know what that is lol), respond to my comment.

    1. Spencer, as I’ve said, I’ve had to censor some comments that have taken what I have said and used it as a platform for their own issues. But I’ve had to censor far more comments that agreed with me than disagreed. As to your assessment that I was never serious about being “born again,” I’m wondering who appointed you God to be able to ascertain that! You can choose to believe me or not, that’s on you.

  3. I’m wondering if you have any evidence for these claims. These are really serious claims that you make without any evidence. You’re legally smart for not naming him tho lol.

      1. Thanks for responding. Sorry for going off on you, I over reacted. Do you plan on releasing the evidence ever or is this as far as you will go (sorry if you already made that clear)?

        Sorry, the whole thing shocked me and I just never expected he would do something like that (not that I 100% believe you, but it’s seems too elaborate to be fake).

        Again sorry for being rude.

            1. Thabk you for your comments, Atticus. Nothing personal, I just will not be naming anybody here. Check today’s post if you want to see my conclusion/update.

          1. Thank you for sharing your experience and shining light in the darkness. Your word needs to get out to the masses. I’ve been following the minister’s celebrity for a while and while it comes as a shock it’s not at all unbelievable. I wish you and your family continued healing and growth in spirit.

          2. This is all very sad and painful and I’m very sorry to hear it. I agree a thousand percent about it being problematic that we don’t talk about these things.

            I now have multiple friends who have told me stories of older boys molesting them as kids. Idk exactly what the answer is. I think what you said about realizing years later that it wasn’t that big of a deal was very interesting. The silence can be torture, guilt-inducing, and amplify the memory way out of proportion. I’ve had experience with remaining silent with some of my own issues, not related to sexual sin, but it caused serious, long term emotional damage. And it’s very strange that much of the advice I received from this minister has been so helpful and I am struggling very much to figure out what to make of all that.

            Thank you for speaking out. The insistence on not ever committing sin and having the dead eyes are definitely things I remember distinctly and being somewhat wary of.

            Anyway, I don’t have your son’s number and I would like to contact him. And I guess the number I had for you isn’t working either. If you are willing, please send me an email with your numbers.

            1. Hey Max! Thanks so much for your thoughtful letter. It is much appreciated. I struggle too w/ the contradictions I see in this man… Sent you the numbers, and look forward to hearing from you soon. -Patrick

              1. I believe the struggle is just the lack of understanding of how tricky the devil is within very prideful people like this. They are psychopaths because their souls are aligned well with their demon (wittingly or not) and that demon needs weaker ones to make fall and feed of of their spiritual essence in that fall. It fulfils the perfectly possessed souls and it simply should be seen, when our good spirit reveals it, and not doubted. All the good doesn’t mean a thing masking that darkness, however really damaged people can still obtain some help simply because of the good words. Ultimately they are a cover up for the psychopath though. They are deceived themselves of course, but this minister I am not so sure how much, because he has had some awareness of deep truths in his earlier years, and I experienced a very cunning and calculated liar at times in my battles with him. Thank God my vision, while not always expressed calmly as I should have, remained intact partly by sharing it with the world in at least an attempt of defending the faith, and knowing deeply that nobody will get away with anything in the next world which is forever. Vengeance is always God’s, and there is a special place in hell for falsely representing the holy spirit and really being free of sinning that Jesus paid such a high price for us all. Shame on the unrepentant ministers of this world.

                1. I wanted to add, that God pulling me out of a several year long earthy hell of hiding and depression, and seeing the devil’s tricks in my own mind, made me see how it works in others. All from seeing myself first and I always keep the light shining on myself first.
                  God bless!

                  1. Thanks, Fabian. Agreed. For the purposes of clarity, I’d call the people you describe “sociopaths,” not “psychopaths.” Sociopaths appear to represent good.

                    1. Yes..got it. Perhaps also a term for someone like this is spiritual vampire.
                      I believe the psychopath word does fit for these high up people pushing the mass murder with the bio-weapons shots, although maybe not because they too are purporting be selling a good thing for all? I may need to change my video title…

                    2. Pat, I’d like you to look at a case that has fascinated me for years and causes me to wonder if a person can be both an inspired visionary leader (doing good work in the world) and a sideline predator at the same time. I know Oskar Schindler had his faults, and was continually unfaithful to his wife while being completely devoted to taking any measures to save the lives of his Jewish work force. Can it be that sometimes people can be two people at the same time? Or alternately at different times? The case I’d like you to look at is the FoxFire Project. A lot of the same dynamics are at work here, with the young men who were victimized reluctant to come forward for a variety of good reasons. One was their love and commitment to the continuation of the FoxFire Project, which was and continues to be a really good thing, not just for the economy of southern Georgia but culturally a good thing for western civilization. They felt the project would be discontinued or at least endangered or damaged by the negative publicity or the bringing down of its founder and leader. They also had mixed feelings about their old teacher, grateful for being the only inspiring educator to really give their lives some kind of meaning and really turn them onto a living project where they could actively contribute in a big way in making a real difference. A number of them even discussed their experiences amongst themselves for years, weighing the pros and cons of coming forward, not wanting to hurt either their old teacher (who both inspired and victimized them), nor the project of which they were justly proud, nor the community either. Ultimately, it was the knowledge that their former teacher was still victimizing young boy students that caused them to come forward and testify, in order to put a stop to the further victimization of others. This rather than any evening of scores for wrongs committed against themselves. Yes I am more interested in the magic of the genisis and development of FoxFire Project itself than the heart-sinking tragedy of sexual abuse and legal proceedings that paralleled it. But this parallel story echoes pertinent lessons, relevant right now for us in our situation. Both stories are human stories and can teach us valuable lessons. Here are some links you might want to explore: https://stevewalburn.com/sometimes-a-shining-lie/ https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2017/03/17/520038859/the-foxfire-book-series-that-preserved-appalachian-foodways https://www.foxfire.org/ https://www.foxfire.org/foxfire-summer-leadership-film-project/ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eliot_Wigginton

                      1. Thank you, David. I checked the links, and read the first link story word for word–very interesting. Can a person do “good work” and do bad things? It would at least appear that way (but more on that below).

                        Is knowing the good a good reason for ignoring and failing to expose the bad? I don’t think so. But for me, what it did come down to (as it came down to for others in the story you provided) was not exposing for my sake, but for the sake of others who may have been involved, or who could currently be at risk (and to warn this person that they are being watched).

                        Also, when it comes down to a struggle between the “good” someone may be doing, and the bad they have done, I had this same struggle. In the end, I believe the sanctity of the human soul and its freedom outweighs “works.” Even if those works may be benefitting others.

                        And in my case, the “good works”–from what I have seen–are mixed with the subject’s desire to lead the seeker to HIM (he denies that, of course) instead of leading others to the “teacher within.” That is not true Christianity, and is of critical importance to the salvation of our souls.

                        In other words, if I were sure that truly good work was being done there, it would have been even harder to step forward.

                        Actually, the more I ponder this, I don’t think it’s even POSSIBLE that truly good work can combine with this kind of deviancy. Look at the boys the man in your story “taught.” In many ways, he corrupted their bodies and souls. No physical benefit can outweigh that damage.

                        1. Yes and that was my issue…the “good” was not really so good if you are aware and hear the spirit of the speaker. And if someone claims to teach and be truly free of sinning, and clearly not be, that is at least as bad as the sexual one. Misrepresenting the holy spirit, I believe is written about as the only unforgivable sin in the bible. My surprise has also been how asleep even many conservatives are and could not see that deadness in this minister. People who are really truly totally saved are very dynamic and have a sweetness to them. Examples…Roy and Reagan and I know there are many others who are not public figures. I have a big issue with dumbing down real salvation, however I needed to yell it from the rooftops too much and that was a lack of faith on my part.

                          1. I completely agree with you on all these points, Fabian. It is so easy to fool the masses. We need to discern with the Spirit. Perhaps I can put this in another way that may be more simple for some to understand: Trust what you see–in that moment before your thoughts flood in and confuse you!

                            1. Yes..that ages old intellect and the spirits behind it. As we let that pass, in all moments of our day, we become freer and freer and can defend and stand up for good.

                            2. The minister, (the one i believe that you’re referring to) openly speaks out against homosexuality and any sex outside of marriage. Your story about your sexual relationship with the minister highlights a real moral discrepancy. It’s hard to fathom how the minister could justify in his own mind having sex acts with another man when a core part of his message is that homosexuality is a sin and the essential need for men to return to the father and proper spiritual order. Is it a simple issue of one teaching what he needs to himself learn? I could understand a temporary fall from grace and giving in to a sexual compulsion/vice but then immediately repenting and self correcting away from the wrong, but years of continuous sexual relations while admonishing others for doing the same type of acts? I have a hard time sorting that one out in my mind. It makes sense it took you a while to sort it out mentally and spiritually. We are living in a “calling out wrongs” culture (cancel culture) and therefore it seems like taking your experience public here is your #metoo moment—calling out a blatant hypocrisy & wrong doing as a warning to all—along with request that the minister stops his current course. That’s fair, and your right to do so, even though for many reasons I personally am generally against the calling out culture. With that said, I recognize the healing, heeding and awakening that can come from it. On another note, I do question your argument about the minister being a cult leader. I can see the cult of personality as an issue with this particular minister, (a media personality guru of sorts) but seems different than a true blue cult leader in the vein of Jim Jones, Ron Hubbard, The Pope, etc. With that said, i realize you might know things i don’t know about him and his followers but every spiritual leader with any influence, whether good or evil, including Jesus, Socrates and even Buddha—were all accused of being cult leaders in their time. The term “cult” and “cult leader” is subjective—based on one’s personal point of view about God, life, morality, etc. Okay, enough said, just wanted to add my 2 cents.

                              1. Great letter, Walter! Let me just take your main points in brief:

                                1. Yes, this was more than a moral “slip-up.” so can’t be explained in that manner, and is indeed hypocritical “to the max.” But more than likely, he will respond tomorrow at his church service with the same “we all have vices–it’s about the heart” answer. This just doesn’t cut the mustard, obviously, when your “vices” are going on for years and affecting others (in my case, helping me commit adultery!) How to explain that? Basically in the same way he has said of others, “The Devil has his mind.” The Devil is quite crafty, and works to one degree or another on ALL of our minds.

                                2. The “Me Too” moment: Yeah, I’ve certainly thought of that, and held back for a long time in fear of that. I generally don’t like the movement either, with a few exceptions. But I think what moved the scale for me, in the direction of coming out with this, is of course putting out a warning to he and others who could also be involved, but also my increasing realization that the “good” he is doing (that caused me pause to begin with) is offset by a lot of “cult”-like behavior which tends to draw people to HIM and not to God (his protestations to the contrary). This moves me into point three…

                                3. Along with my post, I posted “The 12 Characteristics of a Cult Leader.” I know he scoffs at the idea that he is one, that he doesn’t even know how to “brainwash” people, but as I have said, the Devil DOES know how to brainwash people, and works through human beings as discussed. Now, not everyone may see the connections to this minister after reading the “Characteristics” article, but I know him well, and can clearly see EVERY one of those characteristics in him, though some are admittedly subtle. Of course, remember that the Bible says that “the Serpent was/is the most subtle of all creatures.” Yes, the term is “subjective” to different people, but as these characteristics are Satan-inspired/possessed, in the truest sense they are “objective”–kind of scientific, if you will. It’s just a matter of observing the characteristics, which the name means they are COMMON to all cult leaders.

                                I hope this helps, Walter. Feel free to ask me anything else you wish, and I either will or won’t answer depending on if I feel it is good for me to do so or not. Thank you for staying objective about this.

                                Sincerely,

                                -Patrick

                            3. Postscript: I have learned so much through this process–it’s overwhelming, really. And I’m learning as I go. I’ve realized that this story is as much about me as it is about the individual who took advantage of my weaknesses.

                              This person may at some point truly realize how he hurt me and particularly my family. My family was hurt not because I confessed my sin to them, but because of the sin itself. As I said, those close to us know SPIRITUALLY that something is wrong–whether we say something to them or not. And our sin passes to them.

                              But this person may NEVER truly see what THEY have done. And many of his followers may not believe me, of if they do, consider me foolish for exposing it on these pages. And I may have to live with that–the temptation to hate the abuser for “getting away with it.”

                              Of course, if you believe in God, as I am learning to do, nobody ever “gets away with it.”

                              To anyone who has used my story here for their own purposes (they are likely not even aware of it, just as the minister I exposed is likely not aware of his own excuses, rationalizations, and scripture-twisting), I say to you, that I cannot continue to allow you to settle scores here, or wallow in “I told you so’s.”

                              I have hurt people in the past, such as Fabian, for my part in making his life harder. I’m truly sorry about that. Likewise though, I know that, as I said to another poster, WE are ultimately in control of what happens to us, and once his point was made, or once he was told that someone did not wish to continue hearing from him, he would respect that.

                              We must continually watch ourselves to see that our motives our pure. I have been angry about what was done to me and my family. I hope I have not stepped further than I should have. I also realize that by knowing something, I had an obligation to warn others so they can have their eyes wide open.

                              I’m not a perfect man, but I am certainly becoming a better man. I wish the same for all of you (of course, if you’re a woman, I don’t want you to become a better MAN, but you get the point! 🙂 ).

                              Upon reflection, I have had to remove some replies that put more “business” out there than I believe is necessary. And I will continue to remove ANY and ALL posts that I believe to be in any way vindictive, “score-settling,” etc.

                              For anyone who seeks the true spiritual path, I believe that we should always seek the best for everyone involved.

                              I am not planning on going after anyone, or take this further than I have, at least not at this point. If I find out that more is going on than I am now aware of, that I can substantiate, then as they say, “All bets are off.” But I truly hope that is NOT the case.

                              Please do not attempt to get into any “back and forths” with me on this matter–I’m firm in this. The comment area is for all of our betterment. I will no longer allow it to become something else.

                              I have a life to lead, and I truly look forward to getting back to it after this upheaval, that I’m fully aware I helped create by getting this weight off me to begin with. Please forgive me for any oversights.

                              I wish you all the beauty that is unfolding in my life, as I let go of my BLAME of others, and take responsibility for MY part.

                              God bless you!

                              Patrick

                                1. Fabian, I’ve let your comments stand. I have no plans to deviate from the way I’ve laid out this story. That said, despite your excesses, I have always respected your willingness to state and stand by what you see–and often is–truth. These posts would not eve been possible without the reminder that I really did see some of the spiritual tricks I saw. That being said, it’s time we step aside and let some others speak (if they so wish). Take care, Patrick

                                  1. last comment I swear! : ) Some people, as you have, believed I was mad at this unnamed minister and perhaps you?…for taking me ridiculously to court on a trumped up charge, (I won that first round in court actually which I did not even realize, looking back on a legal web page) but truth is that I always considered it, and it truly was, a sort of badge of honor to be attacked by this person, to the point of perjury in court. It was actually all told, done not perfectly by me at all!, but it still was a blessing. I never resented you nor that minister for doing that. I KNEW I shook the tiger by the tail. The viciousness of the retaliation was a shocker though, but that was ok. My problem was I was not inner calm enough, and I wanted too badly to warn his audience about his phoniness and misrepresentations of salvation. People just tended to think I was doing it because I was bitter about what I had to go through. Not so. I fully acknowledge I ignited that fight to become bigger, but only after he did things to try and intimate me and separate me from my friends. So why would I then resent the trial I had to go through? That would be really foolish. It was my lack of enough faith to see and know that the world did not need me to blast the warning in weekly Youtubes. People can see for themselves the dullness and deadness, which you aptly wrote about. That was my bad.
                                    Ok, I will be quiet now.
                                    Thank you

                                      1. Well, as long as everyone is commenting I might as well jump in the pool (while the water is still warm) and put in my perplexed and utterly dumbfounded two cents worth. I was hoping to read something that was not so heavy, hard hitting, or relevant. I feel God is of the opinion that we all have become too complacent and need a good kick, or rather multiple strong kicks, in the duffs to wake us up out of our spiritual slumber. After burying my dear Mother yesterday and dealing with a calidescope of other similarly ranking and pressing concerns, now this. I suppose the actual fact of getting it out is a form of good news, even if the news getting out ain’t so pretty. Like taking some pliers and with a strong but slow yank removing a very large wooden splinter that has been festering for years. I wish I had something more intelligent to say, or at least something that would make me sound more intelligent. “Jesus Christ! This is heavy stuff!” Reading this article out loud (over the phone)to our dear friend Sharon hasn’t exactly had the same feel of my readings to her of chapters from the book “Flatland”. But we definitely are outside the “comfort zone” of our usual 2 dimensional universe. I’m glad you got it out, even if looking at it is an unpleasant experience in the extreme. Ahhhhhh!!! Need to sleep on this. Maybe if I jump in bed and go to sleep, then when I wake up tomorrow it will dissapear and I “won’t have to deal with it”!

                                        1. Yes, so true that we tend to need a swift kick of tough love. I received mine from Roy before he passed and I am so grateful.
                                          I don’t know if Pat knows this about me, but I had a friendship with an older man who became like a mentor for me when I was a little drug addict at 15 years young. He is the one that introduced me to the LP record , Be Still and know, which immediately got me off of drugs. He used to take me to Roy’s talks on occasion and I thought he was friends with Roy. So long story short, he tells me that I needed to stop the meditation, I forgot his reasoning, and he took mind control over me in odd ways. Then, when I turned 18 and graduated, he, I and his mom and two older sister all took an old school bus and our cars up to Grants Pass to live. It was then one evening, he tried to make a sexual move on me very clearly. I turned over in my sleep and acted like it never happened, but after a short time, I blew my stack and got very verbally angry and let it all out. I then moved away and went back to so. Ca. to work and live. He called me up years afterwards oddly when I was having a midlife crisis, and still had interest in me. His demon knew and was trying to get close again. No cigar, thank God. I did take a drive up to San Francisco years later where he lived, and he apologized to me as he was chain smoking, I saw he was raked with guilt and self judgment. I told him no problem, that some of it was because of my weakness. Life is so much about having courage and standing on what we see, even if it is with some anger, we can see that and be sorry and do it better next time. If we cower and take no stand, then doubts and excuses of demonic original can take liberties in our minds. Much of the lesson Patrick has learned the painful way. I have been cowardly too plenty of my life.

                                      2. All that is required of us in this life is atonement. Admitting our sin. And confessing especially to those that we have hurt. For those that continue to deny there crimes to the ones they have hurt. There is a worse punishment. Carrying there guilt to there grave.

                                      3. Pat, Thank you for sharing your journey, it’s very helpful to my own and at this time in my life. On another note, your message is yours to tell. Stand in it and for it, but don’t let it be over-shadowed by spiritual psychotics like Fabian. Fabian is obviously resentful, dangerously obsessed and has an ax-to-grind with the minister and packaged in the name of “truth”. That’s fabians problem, not yours. Be weary of the bats 🦇 coming out of the belfry to “support” but who also are driven by demons. You’ve been around long enough to know that people like fabian are grace robbers and the dude is just OFF. I’m sure what i’m saying is the obvious to you but wanted to bear witness to both the dark, and the light in this conversation.

                                        1. Thank you so much, Walter. I had been thinking of some of this overnight, and you’re right on the money. The intent of all of this was to get some things off my chest, and to warn others because I simply don’t know the extent of this problem (i.e.: are there others out there who have been affected besides myself and one other I’m aware of). I had intended to write just the one piece, but the minister’s denials and veiled attacks caused me to respond.

                                          With some of these comments, particularly Fabian’s, I’ve realized that there is more of an attack here, with score-settling, and “I told you so’s”. These are not good motives, and I have had to take down some of the comments.

                                          Fabian is an old friend, and much of what he has to say is true. And I have failed him in the past by my blindness and loyalty to others, even when they were wrong. I’m sorry about that now.

                                          What’s said has been said, and at this point, I have no intention of going further. As you said, that is MY call.

                                          I sincerely hope that Fabian can see the folly in continuing to going after a minister–particularly for other sins such as hypocrisy and teaching a distorted Gospel. But if we were to try to “out” every minister who preaches a false gospel, we will be “outing” into eternity.

                                          The bottom line for myself, Fabian, and all of us is to see where WE are wrong. How did WE put ourselves in a position to be abused? Ultimately, God has given us control. Fabian is angry for a minister for going after him–and I agree that the issue could have been taken care of in a much better manner, but it also would have ended if Fabian would have dropped the matter once he’d gotten it off his chest.

                                          I pray that he sees all of this, and that he can move forward in peace, as I and all of us much do if we truly seek what is right, and wish to experience God’s full forgiveness and peace.

                                          Thanks again, and God bless you1

                                          1. I truly am not angry Patrick, and even when I was going through the insanity, I felt like it was good for me. But yes, I had, as I mentioned, some inner emotion (anger from childhood dealing with mean authorities) that I mistook as passion. For sure I went on and on with that, largely because I don’t like real salvation being misrepresented and is one of yes, so many false ministers. However, he is the only one that I know that claims to be the example of being free of sin totally, yet is not. That was always my beef. People just tended to project that it is personal. I never felt offense personally by said minister…I knew he hates God and that was the attack…an inner light that was exposing him and trying to help awaken people around him from that grasp. For sure I did not do it perfectly and would have done it differently had it happened again and yes, backed off sooner. I understand that you do not want to take it further Pat, my concern expressed was for continued misrepresentation of Jesus daily, and the gullible souls he still pulls in. And possible other young guys who could be caught in same sexual web. I don’t know if that is occurring still? I feel nothing towards him, and am very grateful you have awakened and taken your courage back. That is the bottom line for me. And If this minister were to come out and repent it would be awesome.
                                            I apologize for mentioning his name in my comments as it is your choice, however I will add, you are all but doing it yourself, without doing it, having people have an unresolved question mark in their their minds, many of them have doubted what they have seen in his demeanor and have still followed him, and you could help them to see their own doubts and weakness by not keeping part of this still “secret”. I know several of them and any mention of his phoniness even with a light heart if someone brings him up, was met as me being a traitor to conservatism, or such. I rarely will even comment of the truth now if he is brought up in conversations over lunch, I just let it go. However, think you are trying to be a bit coy with not revealing the name, but so be it.
                                            I intended not to mean “see, I told you so”, but simply that my vision and for sure imperfect war, is even more vindicated. I take zero joy in the sins of anyone.
                                            I just want to end with…as you know, it is an especially wicked thing to misrepresent real salvation, the very blessed and not so well taught state, to the world, and Jesus’s example of how he spoke at times to the pharisee hypocrite shows us that. I know vengeance in eternity is God’s, nobody will get away with anything if not repented of.
                                            Just consider please.
                                            So much evil now going on, and so many “conservatives” still going along with DJT while he stands back and remains silent on these real bio-weapons, when his warnings would save lives, of which many are children now. The assault has stepped up. But thankfully, I do not go on and on and rant and rave against Trump. I simply post truths, and on occasion it will include him and people’s gullibility and lack of connection to God. Very much the same as what I saw and see with said minister, but different within me, thank God. 100% the inner light needs to be firstly towards ourselves.
                                            Take care,
                                            Fabian

                                          2. And yes sir, it would have ended had I stopped! You see, I thought I needed to shout it out to the world that said minster is not what he claims, but that was a lack of faith that truth always comes out, and that people can see for themselves what is fairly evident, beyond the “good” words.
                                            I am not perfect, but thankfully on the Path, so not sure where all of that that Walter wrote about me is about. That is not me he wrote about, thank God. I think he is reading into and projecting, from what I wrote, but ok.

                                          3. Thank Goodness I stopped years back Pat. My comments, although I get where you are coming from, were about you being more revealing, as I wrote already. I have no desire to, it is not really my business now. If I ever do commentary concerning the said minister now, (which I do not even do) it is in a different light and not so much about the person, but deep spiritual weaknesses that so many grow up with. No more warpath…long ago stopped. I am sorry for writing his name here, I should have not done so seeing you were not.
                                            Thank you

                                        2. This person described is not a minister of the gospel or a pastor/teach. This person is a predator.

                                          From the staggering twisting of scripture to the omission of the bible defined nature of sin, this is a demon–not a Christian. Thank You for exposing this satanic person.

                                          Sadly, this is an all too common story among the Saints of the church. I am happy you are free from this monster. May God Almighty continue to heal your soul. Many blessings for you and your family.

                                          Luke 8:17 (NIV)
                                          For there is nothing hidden that will not be disclosed, and nothing concealed that will not be known or brought out into the open.

                                          Luke 8:17 (NKJV)
                                          For nothing is secret that will not be revealed, nor anything hidden that will not be known and come to light.

                                        3. Dear Patrick,
                                          Thank you so much for sharing this – much to ponder here – shocking really, as I never would have guessed. It helps me too. Because I’m still quite gullible and put people on pedestals. And this is just another sign to watch and wait and look within for the answers. You are blessed Patrick – the truth is setting you and your family free.

                                          1. Thank you, Nancy! Most of us have been gullible, and unwilling to stand on what WE see and know. Like the preacher–we have been caught up in rationalizations, and have sometimes flat-out refused to see what is right in front of us. As I indicated in the piece, we put people on pedestals as “authority figures” because we are not sure of ourselves, and they present the “certainty” we seek. Unfortunately, inevitably in some form or another, they take advantage of it. My actions did cause a lot of pain in my family, but as I’ve said, that is all healing (we’re doing better than ever!), and truthfully, I’ve learned something it was my destiny to learn, based on my background. It all culminated together and fit like a glove. And it it truly “Amazing!”

                                          2. yes Nancy…and you seemed to be one who judged me very harshly when I wrote anything truly honest about Jesse, because it went against what you wrongly believed.

                                        4. I’m sorry this happened, but I’m still in shock right now. It explains questions I had in my mind about Jesse and some of the men that go to the church. I stopped going because I start seeing something in Jesse that didn’t sit well with me. I asked God that if Jesse was the truth allow me to see it, so that I may attend again. I know its two sides to a story, so I don’t want to go all in right now, but I can tell from your writings you’ve been wanting to get something off your chest about Jesse. It just so surreal for me right now. I pray for you and your family to continue to heal.

                                          1. Thank you, Sonja, I appreciate that! You are blessed to have been able to listen to your conscience. It took me awhile to be able to trust in it. And yes, my writings about these issues have steadily progressed from vague to clear–more clarity was necessary.

                                        5. God has rejoiced over your finally having courage and enough pain to wake up and speak up. Sorry to say, but Jesse and his types are predators. But weakness allows it, of course.

                                          1. Thanks, Fabian. Yes, it takes two to “tango.” I fully acknowledge that my weakness allowed this evil to occur, as I mentioned in these posts. But God is good, and He is working this out for my family’s betterment.

                                            1. Wow! Wow! Wow!

                                              This 3rd trilogy is profound! The courage it took for you to expose the “EVIL” this preacher is doing is astounding! Someone had to expose him, and God chose you! This is a “WAKE UP CALL”, to anyone who is putting faith in this individual, to stand up and take a stand! Not to cower, not to ignore, not to make excuses. No one, with any common sense, can rationalize and say that this didn’t happen to you. It’s plain and clear in black and white! And why would you come forward if this wasn’t true! And I will also say, I know the second person with claims towards this preacher regarding sexual molestations, are True and correct!

                                              This preacher needs to know, if he repents and I prays to God, he will know that God is waiting for him, and the Devil is shivering in fear of being outdone!

                                              1. yes yes…putting faith in anybody, especially someone like Jesse who claims to be fully free of sin…when our own intuition shows us otherwise, is key. We have to learn to trust that 100%. I trusted what I saw wrong about Jesse, but I was not totally calm about. My bad. Didn’t think it got that bad with him, but not really that surprised. Power corrupts so often and as Roy used to say, power over people turns sexual. Jesse is and was a con man who I believe is also conned by his demon’s own lies.

                                            2. I never got close to this guy as I told you before not because I thought he was evil but he and I clashed in spirit however we remained on friendly terms mainly because of family members being very involved in his ministry.
                                              I could see that he had issues with blacks and women but had no idea of the extent of it.
                                              Obviously he didn’t take his own advice in forgiving his own parents as he demands his followers to do in order to be “free”!
                                              Since he has not come to you and your family to admit his wrong and asked for forgiveness I do not believe that he has changed from his wicked ways. I do hope as you have mentioned that his followers will not fall into his trap as you did. If it was possible for you then it’s possible for many others. Satan gives power to those that he can use and of course a little good is sprinkled in to make it look legitimate. I hope that your blog will open many eyes and be a warning of what can happen when one is unaware.
                                              Thanks for your courage which it took to expose this minister. I am happy to hear joy in your wife and son’s voices and knowing that the family is healing.
                                              May God bless you as you move on in life!

                                              1. Thank you, Brother! We really appreciate your support! I’ve lived and learned some great life lessons. I’m just sorry others had to be hurt in the process. To be fair to the minister, he finally apologized to us when pressed with the facts. He did seem to he more concerned, though, that I had told my family that we had done illicit acts together.

                                                  1. Yes Charles, and he has forfeited any right to a ministry of God and Jesus. But often justice does not come in this world, but we shall see. This should be exposed and he deposed, if possible. I believe it is only chance for salvation, but I saw that years ago about him. His organization keeps his illusions of being something he is not alive.

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *